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maggie19
11/22/04, 03:47 pm
The 2004 presidential election is barely over, and already dozens of politicians are positioning themselves as possible 2008 presidential candidates.
Wikipedia has a comprehensive list of possible 2008 presidential candidates at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._p..._election,_2008
Another large list of possible 2008 presidential candidates is at http://www.100towatch.com/
These lists include the obvious names like Hillary, Rudy, Arnold, Ralph and Jeb, but there are many other lesser-known possible 2008 presidential candidates.
One thing is certain: It's going to be an interesting four years before the 2008 presidential election.
John Mcain has been promised a shot. He sold his soul to Bush for it in the 2004 election.
For the Democrats, probably someone not yet well known. I still like Wesley Clark, but I don't know if he has quite the right stuff.
Michael DeM
12/05/04, 01:19 pm
Personally, I'd like to see Dennis Kucinich run again. He may not win the nomination ,but at least his message may be heard by more people. I doubt that Howard Dean will run again. He's pretty realistic and probably figures that if he lost once, he'll lose again. The same could be applied to any of the other democrats except Kucinich. The republicans talk so much about Hillary Clinton running, but I think they just want her to run because she seems like an easy target for a smear campaign. I guess the next nominee will be someone we haven't heard of before.
joepol4
12/05/04, 08:35 pm
well in response to the 2008 prez candidate list; (if theres still a usa left to govern -oops sorry to sound so pessimistic ) i take a look back and see that of the past 2 dem presidents (Carter & Clinton) both were governors and both came from the south.. so i might offer that we might be best served by someone like Gov. Warner of Virginia or Bredesen of Tenn. Edwards could make another run and Wes Clark as well. From the midwest Durbin of Illinois or Bayh of Indiana or Vilsack of Iowa. You can bet Hillary will be a factor as well.
Yes. It seems that the south is uniquely tied to, well, "the south" and will only vote for one of their own. After 8 years of Bush, I, and most of the world, would really love to have an American president who can speak... and think. Surely, we can come up with a southerner who qualifies. Apparently, southerners aren't as scary to the rest of the country as the rest of the country is to southerners.
republicantx
02/01/05, 12:45 pm
Isn't that cute. Someone put Arnold on the list. What a great man to run for president. Wait just a minute......
HE'S FREAKIN' AUSTRIAN!
mdbasement
02/01/05, 03:07 pm
He's also a Republican. As you may have noticed, that's not really what most of us support.
Love Hillary but agree with what you say about the easy smear target.
Hope she will stay in the senate (where there are no term limits) and become a super-power. She can do so much for the country right where she is.
I sure like what I saw on Meet The Press today. Senator Russ Feingold Is right on target about the war in Iraq ..............been on target since the beginning!
He wants a plan NOW to get out of Iraq! He's right! Put the Iraqi's on notice to get their act together ..........set up THEIR Constitution NOW and get THEIR people running THEIR militia and security forces because we're not staying in Iraq!
He also said all the right things to revive "The American Dream".
A healthcare program for ALL.
Bring the jobs home.
Protect our borders..............more..........wish I taped it. He is a person saying ALL the right things...........
Here's Senator Feingold of WI on Iraq before the war all the way to NOW.
.
http://feingold.senate.gov/issues_timeline.html
Republicantx wrote, in part, 'Isn't that cute. Someone put Arnold on the list.' Thank God that will never happen. Look at what a mess he has California in. As far as the 2008 Presidential election, I believe the Democrats could run Mickey Mouse and beat the Republican candidate. The American people are disgusted with the way the country has been ran for the past five years, as I am sure the will be disappointed in the next three. Under Bush's watch, we have exported tens of thousands of manufacturing jobs, seen our children die in an unjust war, watched our national debt skyrocket, paid over three dollars a gallon for gasoline, and witnessed cuts to most programs which benefit our less fortunate.....should I keep going?
gratelady1
09/23/05, 02:28 pm
Republicantx wrote, in part, 'Isn't that cute. Someone put Arnold on the list.' Thank God that will never happen. Look at what a mess he has California in. As far as the 2008 Presidential election, I believe the Democrats could run Mickey Mouse and beat the Republican candidate. The American people are disgusted with the way the country has been ran for the past five years, as I am sure the will be disappointed in the next three. Under Bush's watch, we have exported tens of thousands of manufacturing jobs, seen our children die in an unjust war, watched our national debt skyrocket, paid over three dollars a gallon for gasoline, and witnessed cuts to most programs which benefit our less fortunate.....should I keep going?
If you dont keep going you are just helping Bush. ;)
snowdog
09/26/05, 10:05 am
I hear that gratelady1 !!!
First of all, I want to thank the creators of this web page so I have an opportunity to share common thoughts and concerns with other Democrats across the country.
During the 2004 Presidential campaign, my family was very involved, phone banking, door-to-door visits, registration drives, fundraising etc.... I can't begin to describe the feeling we had when WV went red. We were even more devastated when Ohio (our former home of twenty-five years) voted for Bush.
But back to WV. In some counties in West Virginia, the Democrats outnumber the bad-guys by 15:1. Can you believe that??? My family had an opportunity to get to know the voters of West Virginia and the issues important to them. The three G's....guns, gays and God. For the record: Guns? More people in West Virginia have lost their guns under the Bush administration than any other. They have had to pawn them to buy food or pay utilities because the good paying job they had is now in China. Gays? You should see the 'Conservative - God fearing citizens' you see sneaking out of the gay bar. And with the God issue, abortion always raises its ugly head. Are the numbers right from family services??? More abortions have been performed during Bush's watch than ever before?.... Seems like their platform and agenda are working well. It's interesting, they want to stop abortions but not discuss what to do with these children. How do we feed, clothe, house, and educate them. I know, let’s cut funding to the social programs. As far as Presidential candidates for 2008, I believe Hillary Clinton would be a worthwhile candidate. She is a strong, intelligent and compassionate. But, as I mentioned earlier, we are very active and I am somewhat ashamed to admit that West Virginia would NEVER vote for a woman as President, no matter how qualified the candidate.
The Republicans in West Virginia have already started a vicious attack against the Honorable Senator Byrd. Senator Byrd is up for re-election next year and the rumor mill has Shelley Moore Capito (Bush's puppet) as getting the nod to run against Senator Byrd.
Wait a minute.....wasn't Shelley Moores father the former Governor of West Virginia, Arch Moore? Didn't Arch Moore go to PRISON for ? Here's an article on Archie Boy....kind of interesting.
http://www.state.wv.us/wvsca/docs/fall03/25794.pdf
Once again, thanks for allowing me to vent and share common ground. Please keep the Honorable Senastor Byrd in your thoughts as we prepare for battle against the forces that will do anything to destroy this WEST VIRGINIA HERO.
gratelady1
09/26/05, 01:28 pm
Would you consider an outside third party, not controlled by the repubs or the dems?
Sure....all is fair in love and politics. Did not intend to 'discount' any one person and/or party. Around here, you are one or the other, Democrat or Republican. Always willing to become educated in politics as this is a new arena for me and my family.
gratelady1
09/26/05, 03:12 pm
Sure....all is fair in love and politics. Did not intend to 'discount' any one person and/or party. Around here, you are one or the other, Democrat or Republican. Always willing to become educated in politics as this is a new arena for me and my family.
Yes that is how politics is controlled, by the affluent today. Just like religon, you either can go to heaven or hell, there maybe a purgatory, but who would want that? This is the psychology, that prevents the formation of outside, new parties, that plus amikg you feel dumb for even considering a 3rd party. In other wordsyou have no choice at all, just thier choices.
As I indicated earlier, I am in my infancy stages with respect to politics. I agree there needs to be another Party affiliation that actually represents people. Perhaps a Labor Party that represents the 'every-day-joe' instead of the special interests and big money lobbyists. But within our current structure, I am confined to participate in a political environment of little choice. Sometimes you have to participate to fascilitate any change, no matter how small that change may be and no matter if you agree with the majority of thier agendas. Perhaps someday, maybe not in our lifetime, there will be a Party for the People.
gratelady1
09/27/05, 10:07 am
As I indicated earlier, I am in my infancy stages with respect to politics. I agree there needs to be another Party affiliation that actually represents people. Perhaps a Labor Party that represents the 'every-day-joe' instead of the special interests and big money lobbyists. But within our current structure, I am confined to participate in a political environment of little choice. Sometimes you have to participate to fascilitate any change, no matter how small that change may be and no matter if you agree with the majority of thier agendas. Perhaps someday, maybe not in our lifetime, there will be a Party for the People.
I believe your right, not in this lifetime.
joepol4
09/28/05, 01:22 pm
welcome to the pol forum Randy:
well i have to admit i was disappointed in West Virginians last fall as i felt we had a good chance to paint ole West Va. blue - but it just didn't happen. Also you can bet they (repubs) will go after Sen. Byrd and try and get him unseated in 06 -only question is how far will they go? Tennessee is pretty similar politically to West Va. and it seems like transcending issues are God, guns and gays and the GOP knows that plays right into their hands. As for a third party evolving in the states -the prospects are pretty bleak - not enough grassroots power but we can always hope.
snowdog
09/28/05, 05:36 pm
Am I to understand that the Republicans will go after Sen Byrd, and unseat
him? I'm a little confused, isn't that what happens in about every
election between all the parties? I don't know much about the politics of
W. Virginia, but don't the people elect their representatives? If the majority
don't want Byrd, and a Republican is what the majority wants then thats
the way it will work, Byrd will be re-elected, If not for his politics, then for
a chance to set an election record. Isn't he the guy that shortly after Sen
Lott used bad Judgement in talking about Sen Thurmond and his former stance
on equal rights, isn't Sen Byrd the guy who also used bad judgement in grammer
as Lott did? humm guess Sen Byrd gets the pass huh?
As for how far will the republicans will go to unseat Sen Byrd.......Shame on
them if they go as far as Howie Dean.
Snowdog:
Since you are not familiar with WV politics, let me enlighten you. I welcome the idea that any person eligible can run for any office of their choosing. Once they have made the decision to run, their actions is what I question. I stated that the Rethuglicans have already started attacking Senator Byrd. Heck, all you have to do is tune to talk radio and the slams are there. Try getting past the call screeners to say anything positive about the Senator….
WV Politics… I have witnessed first hand the lengths that the Rethuglicans will go to achieve their goals. The night of the last Presidential debate, I was assaulted by seven Rethuglicans downtown Charleston. The police were involved so this is easily proved. Evidently they did not like the Kerry shirt I was wearing. Although the situation was unwarranted, I still found humor in it as I believe although there were 7 of them and only one of me, they were still outnumbered….cowards. Incidentally, I should note that I did not have to pull out my C.W. to deal with the situation. I have seen people being arrested for standing up against the Bush administration. I have seen families lives destroyed by the half-truths and outright lies during a campaign.
The viciousness of the last elections held in West Virginia is preparing to repeat itself in the Senate race coming up. I see many of the same players involved that have pledge to ‘do whatever it takes’ to eliminate Senator Byrd.
I will be posting additional comments about politics in West Virginia to substantiate my concern over the disgusting road the Rethuglicans will travel to get what they want. Next posting, be prepared to discuss the WV Supreme Court race and the dirty deeds done by the Rethuglicans.
snowdog
09/29/05, 10:58 am
Like I said I don't know what the story behind W Virginia politics is. I am
from here in Wa State, You know, the one that The Eastern side of
Washington was trying to split off from Western Wa. Partly because of
the Election Does the Names Rossi and Gregoire sound familiar in the news.
and of course the entirety of Eastern Wa is red, as is oddly enough, Western
Wa. BUT.....King County (Seattle) is blue. So yea I can relate to rough
Politics.
7 Guys threatened you?, I hope they get Punished harshly enough so that
they realize that will not be no be tolerated.
As for bringing up race issues.......Bring it on, that will be fun.
Rethuglicans? LOL thats creative.
gratelady1
09/29/05, 08:25 pm
Snowdog:
I stated that the Rethuglicans have already started attacking Senator Byrd. Heck, all you have to do is tune to talk radio and the slams are there.
I have seen people being arrested for standing up against the Bush administration. I have seen families lives destroyed by the half-truths and outright lies during a campaign.
The viciousness of the last elections held in West Virginia is preparing to repeat itself in the Senate race coming up. I see many of the same players involved that have pledge to ‘do whatever it takes’ to eliminate Senator Byrd.
I will be posting additional comments about politics in West Virginia to substantiate my concern over the disgusting road the Rethuglicans will travel to get what they want. Next posting, be prepared to discuss the WV Supreme Court race and the dirty deeds done by the Rethuglicans.
This is very interesting, being from WV, can you provide proof that Bryd is not a repub favorite-thus a hack, and will continue to be, till death he do us part?
I believe anyone who has served as long as he has, should be taken out back and
____________-(you fill in the blank)- remember the condtion of this country is the sum total/legacy of the idiots that have controlled the Congress and the Senate for too long now!
Byrd serves the Repubs! regardless of what he says in public and how he votes.
Like I said I don't know what the story behind W Virginia politics is. I am
from here in Wa State, You know, the one that The Eastern side of
Washington was trying to split off from Western Wa. Partly because of
the Election Does the Names Rossi and Gregoire sound familiar in the news.
and of course the entirety of Eastern Wa is red, as is oddly enough, Western
Wa. BUT.....King County (Seattle) is blue. So yea I can relate to rough
Politics.
7 Guys threatened you?, I hope they get Punished harshly enough so that
they realize that will not be no be tolerated.
As for bringing up race issues.......Bring it on, that will be fun.
Rethuglicans? LOL thats creative.
Snowdog:
What makes you think I wanted to discuss the race issue? And with respect to 'rethuglicans', I can't take credit for that, someone else on this site came up with the idea. I just thought it was appropriate and I hope they don't mind me borrowing it.
Gratelady1:
Well, it would be aweful hard to prove or disprove your theory. I can only attest to what Senator Byrd has done for the citizens of West Virginia and our infrastructure. Once again, our choices are limited and I believe he is a better choice than Shelley Moore Capito, the republican counterpart.
snowdog
10/03/05, 07:52 am
Snowdog:
What makes you think I wanted to discuss the race issue? And with respect to 'rethuglicans', I can't take credit for that, someone else on this site came up with the idea. I just thought it was appropriate and I hope they don't mind me borrowing it.
Howdy Randy:
"Next posting, be prepared to discuss the WV Supreme Court race and the dirty deeds done by the Rethuglicans"
that is why I assumed you wanted to discuss race issues.
LOL, I still get a kick outta "rethuglicans". (please understand I don't mean
that in sarcasm)
Jane of Arc
10/03/05, 12:39 pm
We can talk about the 2008 elections like they're "real democratic elections" 'til the cows come home. The truth is we do not have honest, open elections in the United States of America.
So, the question begs ... does it matter who's "selected"? Again?
Until Americans wake up and take this issue to the streets (like they do in other third world countries) ... it's just a pony show!
Republicans own the voting machines.
There is no uniform, verifiable voting system in America.
Diebold can make receipts for your money, but not your vote.
Votes are manipulated, lost and ultimately counted by ... guess who?
And if this isn't pure corruption ... why does a Republican Congress squelch every voting reform bill? Don't they want honest elections?
Isn't that cute. Someone put Arnold on the list. What a great man to run for president. Wait just a minute......
HE'S FREAKIN' AUSTRIAN!
He's got my vote! :cool:
gratelady1
10/16/05, 08:21 am
He's got my vote! :cool:
You probably would give him more than just your vote ADOLPH!
You got no American dignity.... shame..shame...shame..
You probably would give him more than just your vote ADOLPH!
You got no American dignity.... shame..shame...shame..
:D :D :D
gratelady1
10/17/05, 07:41 pm
:p
Jane of Arc
11/06/05, 12:31 pm
I am an independent progressive that sometimes gets this creepy, tickling feeling crawling up and down my spine when certain propaganda becomes blatantly manipulative.
Yesterday on CNN there was a "non-story" saying that Bill Clinton feels Hillary would make a better president than he.
This is NOT news, but rather PROPAGANDA!
When polled 2/3 of the American people want a plan out of Iraq & 90 % of Democrats want out of Iraq and yet Hillary Clinton talks about EXPANDING US troops there! What do these globalists have up their sleeves?
Calling all Progressives, Greens, Independents, Democrats, Libertarians and anyone else that wants our democracy back ... let's find a strong candidate with the voice of the people!
There's a recent article in the Village Voice critical of Hillary's stance on the war at http://www.villagevoice.com/news/0544,lombardi,69553,6.html
I think it would be a mistake to put too much importance on how potential candidates are currently polling, but I do think it sheds some light on this question. The most recent poll (just eyeballing them, they look pretty similar) showing support for democratic candidates goes like this:
Hillary Clinton 41%
John Kerry 16%
John Edwards 15%
Joe Biden 8%
Wesley Clark 5%
Bill Richardson 3%
Evan Bayh 3%
Mark Warner 2%
(from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2008_U.S._presidential_ele ction)
There's a list of a whole slew of Democratic and Green potential candidates at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._presidential_election,_2008.
Does anybody see anybody they like better than Hillary? As for me, I'm scratching my head and wondering what Harry Reid's plans are. I've got a feeling that Howard's grooming him.
Hillary is a pragmatist, running to the center. Ultimately, she will make so many compromises in pursuit of "moderation", she will stand for nothing and have little credibility.
On the war issue, I recognize that a female candidate reknowned as a "liberal", must do all she can to appear strong and be willing (almost eager) to use military power in order to get elected in America (and even then, I think the chances are quite slim at this time).
Now, a general, on the other hand (a la Wesley Clark) has little to prove in this area and can espouse peaceful solutions without a high level of political vulnerability.
As for me, I've had quite enough of both the Bush family and the Clintons (and all of their accompanying baggage).
It's time to move on.
Hillary is a pragmatist, running to the center. Ultimately, she will make so many compromises in pursuit of "moderation", she will stand for nothing and have little credibility.
On the war issue, I recognize that a female candidate reknowned as a "liberal", must do all she can to appear strong and be willing (almost eager) to use military power in order to get elected in America (and even then, I think the chances are quite slim at this time).
Now, a general, on the other hand (a la Wesley Clark) has little to prove in this area and can espouse peaceful solutions without a high level of political vulnerability.
As for me, I've had quite enough of both the Bush family and the Clintons (and all of their accompanying baggage).
It's time to move on.
YEP!
Jane of Arc
11/07/05, 09:58 am
I agree JamesP. Good post ... time to move on from the dynasties of Bush & Clinton. I like Wesley Clark. But do you think he's charismatic enough to capture and lead a much needed democratic grassroot movement?
And haus ... welcome aboard! Your posts are smart, informative and right on the money! Thanks for the Voice article. I missed that one.
I would love to see Al Gore throw his hat into the ring. It's critical now for America to have a leader who would take responsibility for our impact on the global environment seeing that the U.S. is the biggest polluter on earth. There's a BIG internet push to draft him. He's become a Washington outsider who speaks his mind. Boy, oh boy, does he speak his mind! His recent speeches are nothing short of brilliant receiving standing ovations at least 10 times during the speech.
Now that I think about Gore ... dang I'm going to sign that petition!
http://new.petitiononline.com/AG2008/petition.html
Like I said ... he's all over the net:
http://tom-kertes.mydd.com/story/2005/10/22/215531/55
http://www.algore-08.com/index.php?option=com_frontpage&Itemid=78&limit=9&limitstart=18
http://www.democrats.com/node/6564
http://www.buzzflash.com/contributors/05/10/con05368.html
http://lgrooney.dailykos.com/storyonly/2005/10/22/134155/79
http://www2.boomantribune.com/?op=displaystory;sid=2005/10/22/174242/33
http://usliberals.about.com/b/a/209986.htm
http://s8.invisionfree.com/Al_Gore_Support/index.php?showtopic=3352
Lionhearted
11/07/05, 11:45 am
I haven't seen his name put forth on this thread, so I'll stick my neck out. One that could possibly get me a interested in the Democratic Party again would be Barack Obama. He has said on several occassions that he is not interested in the 2008 nomination and he is something of a political novice, which is a part of what I find so appealing.
In case you did not see his keynote address at the Democaratic Convention, here is an excerpt:
If there's a child on the south side of Chicago who can't read, that matters to me, even if it's not my child. If there's a senior citizen somewhere who can't pay for their prescription and having to choose between medicine and the rent, that makes my life poorer, even if it's not my grandparent. If there's an Arab-American family being rounded up without benefit of an attorney or due process, that threatens my civil liberties. It is that fundamental belief -- it is that fundamental belief -- I am my brother's keeper, I am my sisters' keeper -- that makes this country work. It's what allows us to pursue our individual dreams, yet still come together as a single American family: "E pluribus unum," out of many, one.
Now even as we speak, there are those who are preparing to divide us, the spin masters and negative ad peddlers who embrace the politics of anything goes. Well, I say to them tonight, there's not a liberal America and a conservative America; there's the United States of America. There's not a black America and white America and Latino America and Asian America; there's the United States of America. The pundits, the pundits like to slice and dice our country into red states and blue States: red states for Republicans, blue States for Democrats. But I've got news for them, too. We worship an awesome God in the blue states, and we don't like federal agents poking around our libraries in the red states. We coach little league in the blue states and, yes, we've got some gay friends in the red states. There are patriots who opposed the war in Iraq, and there are patriots who supported the war in Iraq.
An entire transcript may be found here (http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0728-13.htm).
I haven't seen his name put forth on this thread, so I'll stick my neck out. One that could possibly get me a interested in the Democratic Party again would be Barack Obama. He has said on several occassions that he is not interested in the 2008 nomination and he is something of a political novice, which is a part of what I find so appealing.
In case you did not see his keynote address at the Democaratic Convention, here is an excerpt:
An entire transcript may be found here (http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0728-13.htm).
Everytime I saw and listened to Barack Obama I was truly impressed with his carriage, sincerity and intelligence! His message and the way he conveyed it was a breath of fresh air!
If only "we the people" would base our opinions on merit we could once again have honest decent representation. Barack Obama.........excellent choice!
Wesley Clark.............and
Al Gore would be on my list of candidates, as is John Edwards.
Just my 2-cents on the issue. I think Obama would be one of the best VP selections since, well, Gore. Eight (successful) years in Air Force 2 would make him a wreckin' machine in 2016.
On the other hand, if he ran and lost for president in '08, statistically speaking, he'd probably never get another chance.
I could get excited about a Edwards/Obama ticket in '08. Or Gore/Obama. Hell, call me crazy, but Clinton/Obama still appeals to me -- I haven't given up on the old girl yet.
Lionhearted
11/07/05, 06:35 pm
Hey Crazy, er ah Haus :p I totally agree that for 2008 Obama would be an excellent choice for VP. I think I would have no problem voting for a Dean/Obama ticket but since that ain't gonna happen, I like your Edwards/Obama ticket.
snowdog
11/08/05, 09:19 am
You all probably think I am BS ing you but I would like to see Joe Lieberman,
run in 08. Obama? I think he comes off pretty good, I need to do a bit more
research on him and his views, I don't think he is too far to the left for me to
consider him.. My only negative thought on him right now is to me, anyways,
He comes off a bit "too" polished. I could be wrong. LOL, the ticket that could
united the country possibly could a Mccain/Lieberman . WOW wouldn't that be
something. Heck they say that the former POW is a "maverick" in the republican
party. he would get a good portion of the repubs, and a good portion of
the Dems, then there is the lieberman factor. Your thoughts please...
I'm from the great state of CT and am for the Dump Joe group in CT. His famous kiss on bush's cheek sickened many of us and proved our thoughts! As for McCain, the way he kissed up to bush after bush cut him sooo bad in the republican primary for the 2000 election...........leaves me cold. I also spend time in AZ and have studied both these men and say, I want neither one of them representing me because neither reflects my hope for my children & grandchildren.
They represent corporate America just fine though. :rolleyes:
snowdog
11/09/05, 10:36 am
I'm from the great state of CT and am for the Dump Joe group in CT. His famous kiss on bush's cheek sickened many of us and proved our thoughts! As for McCain, the way he kissed up to bush after bush cut him sooo bad in the republican primary for the 2000 election...........leaves me cold. I also spend time in AZ and have studied both these men and say, I want neither one of them representing me because neither reflects my hope for my children & grandchildren.
They represent corporate America just fine though. :rolleyes:
Magi, Normally I would respond to that... but since my opinion doesn't go
along with what you are saying, well I guess you'll paste a link from "A Franken"
or the Buzzflash website which are both admittedly extreme Left views. To
which I would respond in kind with a pasted link which of course is "republican
propaganda." So I will just say that I don't agree. And wish that this "democratic
free-for all" discussion forum, would see that one of the very issues the liberal
side is so keen on is not taken here. CENSORSHIP. I guess if everyone agrees,
on the issues, that maybe it makes you feel good, but ignoring others views... I
don't see where that gets anyone.
Jane of Arc
11/12/05, 04:18 pm
I haven't been in this room for a week and I'm surprised and happy to hear that no one is supporting Hillary. Republicans are praying she'll run. She is truly hated in the South and doesn't have a chance here.
But Al Gore has new respect and so does Edwards.
Edwards has made a smart move establishing his poverty center. He tours the country going from college to college drawing remarkable crowds like a rock star. He's definitely running in 2008.
I like your ideas on Obama as a VP choice.
I haven't been in this room for a week and I'm surprised and happy to hear that no one is supporting Hillary. Republicans are praying she'll run. She is truly hated in the South and doesn't have a chance here.
But Al Gore has new respect and so does Edwards.
Edwards has made a smart move establishing his poverty center. He tours the country going from college to college drawing remarkable crowds like a rock star. He's definitely running in 2008.
I like your ideas on Obama as a VP choice.
YES! NOT Hillary! Especially if she knew all the lies were promoted by Chalabi and his agents.....seems Chalabi was well known in Washington as a charlatan doing his BEST to promote war in Iraq............... for 15 years!
The neo cons wanted the same thing. So Chalabi for oil and country control + neo cons for oil control = invasion into Iraq......... using ANY Means THEY could invent to do it!
Best idea to date: Edwards and Obama in 2008! Men of integrity!
joepol4
11/15/05, 12:26 pm
hello all - well i've been conspicuosly absent for a while politicking and such but though i'd jump in here with an offering :
how about Mark Warner and O'Bama in '08 ? now that Kaine was elected the new gov. of Virginia and which makes Mark Warner look even better nationally?
just a thought
Jane of Arc
11/15/05, 05:12 pm
Thanks Jopo14,
I don't know much about Mark Warner other than he was a very popular govenor of Virginia. I googled him and found his state was ranked #1 in the country under his watch. Impressive.
http://results.gpponline.org/StateOverview.aspx?id=138
What else does anyone know about him?
Jane of Arc
11/19/05, 10:46 am
I was impressed as I watched Murtha speak to the House on CSPAN last night. He's a humble, honest American Hero who spoke plain truth. He truly cares about the soldier's plight. He truly cares about America's plight.
The Republicans looked like the lizards they are.
Here's a wild idea ...
I know cosmetically Murtha is not the 'norm' ... old and fat and looks like a loveable uncle you want to hug ... but, damn, he's honest, strong and right on the money! I just may want a president with his or her hair out of place for a change.
MURTHA 2008? :)
...MURTHA 2008? :)
Wouldn't Col. Murtha be a kick-ass Secretary of Defense?
I could get excited about a Edwards/Obama ticket in '08. Or Gore/Obama. Hell, call me crazy , but Clinton/Obama still appeals to me -- I haven't given up on the old girl yet.
Your crazy.
:D :D :D
Wouldn't Col. Murtha be a kick-ass Secretary of Defense?
No I don't think that he would be.
Why do feel that he would be?
Oh, why not...
37 years in the Marines/Reserves, Viet Nam combat vet
received the Bronze Star with Combat "V", two Purple Hearts and the Vietnamese Cross of Gallantry, Navy Distinguished Service Medal
30 years in the Congress
member of House Appropriations Committee and the Subcommittee on Defense, of which he is currently the ranking Member and former Chairman
Barring some horrendous surprise in his 30 years of legislation, I don't see any reason not to like him for the SecDef job.
Jane of Arc
11/21/05, 09:37 am
Haus ... I like your ideas! Yes Murtha would be the PERFECT Secretary of Defense. Great thinking!!!
Last night I heard Mark Warner give a speech in New Hampshire on CSPAN. He's campaigning and making no bones about it. He's taking Hillary on. I was quite impressed with him and more impressed by his record.
He impressed me because he's from humble beginnings and he became a self-made success story. I didn't know he started Nextel and took it global. And his success as Governor of Virginia is stellar. He made Virginia the #1 state in America.
This guy is really worth looking at.
Does anyone know his position on The Iraq War?
Thanks what. :)
The Warner episode of "Road to the White House" is available as streaming video online at http://www.c-span.org/homepage.asp?Cat=Series&Code=RWH&ShowVidNum=6&Rot_Cat_CD=RWH&Rot_HT=205&Rot_WD=. I only caught part of it last night ("Family Guy" came on) but he's not a bad speaker, pretty charismatic actually.
I haven't looked really deeply at him, but there are only two things that make me a little uncomfortable with him: 1) he's a big-business buzillionaire, and 2) he's polling somewhere around 3%. (dailykos has a poll with a completely different result at http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2005/11/21/122347/52) Neither one is an insurmountable problem...
Here's a few items from his wikipedia article:
poll ratings indicate that he is the most popular Virginia Governor in a generation
his record approval ratings of nearly 75% comes in a state that traditionally has voted for the opposite party
co-founded Nextel as well as Capital Cellular Corporation, and built up an estimated fortune of over $200m
his business experience, Southern base, fundraising connections within high-tech and venture capital circles, and record of working with black leaders add up to what some see as an attractive political résumé
From http://draftmarkwarner.com/, he's credited with:
Turned a $6 billion deficit into a $544 Million surplus
Eliminated or merged more than 70 duplicative or unnecessary boards and commissions and eight state agencies
Salvaged Virginia’s threatened AAA bond rating
Double-digit unemployment has plummeted in 12 of 13 of the most distressed counties
97% of all eligible children enrolled in heath care
Single largest investment in K-12 education in state history
Second largest increase in college and university funding in the nation
Highest math SAT score increase in the nation
I'm gonna put big disclaimers on this, but at first blush he seems more hawkish than Hillary on Iraq. For example, from Face The Nation on Nov 13: "But I think the Democratic Party ought to get over refighting how we got into the war and, again, continue to press the president on what he hopes to do in terms of how we will finish the job."
You can urge him to run (he's already announced his candidacy) at http://www.ipetitions.com/campaigns/MarkWarnerforPresident/
Jane of Arc
11/21/05, 12:58 pm
Thank you very much Haus! I truly appreciate the effort you put into your post. And very informative! This is exactly the type of exchange on POL I look forward to. Thanks again.
Okay ... you've given me pause. I want a candidate who has a plan to get us out of the Iraq Tragedy. I think one of the most horrific things I've seen on TV ... right up there with the attack on the World Trade Towers was watching the US military's blitzkrieg on Baghdad. I thought to myself, "Oh my God, how many thousands and thousands of innocent people are dying? People that never did a thing to my country!!!" My absolute loathing of George Bush hit an impossible new low.
But, back to the topic of potential candidates; did you ever have this thought:
Why did Wellstone and Kennedy, Jr. both die in the same type of airplane accidents?
Another thought:
Why are only people on the left assasinated?
I actually met JFK, Jr. He was just starting to talk to his Mom about seeking a political office. She was obviously against it. But, I have to say John Kennedy, Jr. had everything. A brilliant speaker, completely magnetic, charisma beyond any human being I'd ever met and his face on TV ... CaRuMBa!!! He was a shoo in.
Could the powers that be also of seen his power?
Hey, it rhymes!
Anyway, I got the feeling what the NO HILLARY IN '08 thread really needed was a poll. So, indicate the candidates you like and let's see what kind of neat-o arguments we can get into...
You can pick more than one candidate and your votes are visible. That way you can skewer me for my enduring, halfhearted support for Hillary. :)
I'd hoped to put McCain and the two Green candidates in, but there happen to be exactly 10 serious DNC candidates... Sorry.
I just want to say for the record that I might have misread Warner on Iraq. It bears further investigation...
On the JFK Jr. front -- I ain't gonna touch that with a 10-foot-pole. :)
Jane of Arc
11/21/05, 09:21 pm
You must add someone to this list, please sir?
AL GORE
Jane of Arc
11/21/05, 09:25 pm
You can knock off Bill Richardson and add the man who deserves a place more than any other ...
AL GORE!
Yeeks, woops, and golly-gee! I knew I'd screw that up somehow. Maybe if we grovel before -V-, he can put a few more folks in, or replace a couple. I'm pretty sure I can't.
For the record, the list is straight for Wikipedia's top 10 contenders. But that won't stop you from lashing me with a wet noodle. :)
Why are only people on the left assasinated?
Like the assasination attempt on President Reagan? But oh yeh, he survived that one so it doesn't count I guesse.
It must have been planned out that way. ;)
But, I have to say John Kennedy, Jr. had everything. A brilliant speaker, completely magnetic, charisma beyond any human being I'd ever met and his face on TV ... CaRuMBa!!!
Too bad he was too much of an reckless idiot for his own good. Not good qualities to have as a recreational pilot, and from the reports that I have read, not a very good one either. He ignored warnings from others that he shouldn't make the flight because the weather conditions made it too risky, especialy for someone who had little or no experience with flying ---instrements only.
The real tragedy is that in his arrogance it ended up costing the life of his wife.
I voted for Richardson even though I will not be voting for him. But he does seem the best out of that laughable list.
let me know if there are any more feasable candidates and I'll ad them.
I confess that I'm not familiar with:
Evan Bayh
Bill Richardson
Mark Warner
I'd like to see an Al Gore/John Kerry ticket myself. They both deserve a shot at a legitimate election.
John Edwards/Barach Obama......my present feelings..................
Thanks for the help, -V-! :)
Bayh's been lurking around for several years. His dad was governor of Indiana. He's currently a senator from Indiana and former governor of Indiana.
Richardson "has served as a Congressman, United States Ambassador to the United Nations, and U.S. Secretary of Energy; he is presently the Governor of New Mexico. He was also chairman of the 2004 Democratic National Convention that nominated John Kerry for the presidency."
At this point, I don't have any strong feelings about either of them, but it's early.
What? and I had a pretty nifty conversation on Warner on the NO HILLARY IN 08 thread.
Believe it or not, I voted for Bayh when he ran for Governor, and I thought he was a pretty good Governor. I can't see him as being President though, maybe in about 8-12 years I might change my mind on that one. But as of right now, he needs a little more maturing before he makes a run for the Presidency.
Jane of Arc
11/22/05, 08:50 am
You had to think long and hard on that one, didn't you Adolph.
An assassination "attempt" on the right compared to a long list of dead bodies on the left with all their deaths 'explained away' with lies.
Gandhi
President John Kennedy
Robert Kennedy
John Kennedy, Jr.
Martin Luther King
Malcolm X
John Lennon
Paul Wellstone ... and the list goes on ...
But this has been the historic struggle between progressive, peaceful leaders that threaten the power structure of militaristic barbarians.
You lost me when you included JFK Jr. and Paul Wellstone.
Sorry.
Jane of Arc
11/22/05, 09:05 am
:) Thank you-V-for adding Gore! I feel all warm and fuzzy inside! :)
Maybe this time around Al Gore will be able to win his home state of Tennesee.
:D :D
But I have my doubts.
Jane of Arc
11/22/05, 09:26 am
Adolph ~
Okay fine. Leave Wellstone and JFK, Jr. off the list. It's still grim.
The official report on JFK's assassination was a non-sensical magic bullet theory. People doubt "official reports". When the BEST ... the most charismatic leaders on the left ... people that could easily win a country ... die in plane crashes ... everyone on the left has questions and doubts. And understandably so.
Are you still lost?
Jane of Arc
11/22/05, 10:37 am
You're right Adolph. I live in Tennessee and probably Gore can't win here.
There's an awful lot of poorly educated, beer-drinking, Nascar-watching rednecks here. But then again, if there's a big Nascar event on Election Day ... all the smart folk of Tennessee might vote Gore into office in a New York minute!
snowdog
11/22/05, 12:11 pm
You're right Adolph. I live in Tennessee and probably Gore can't win here.
There's an awful lot of poorly educated, beer-drinking, Nascar-watching rednecks here. But then again, if there's a big Nascar event on Election Day ... all the smart folk of Tennessee might vote Gore into office in a New York minute!
Am I understanding your statement correctly What? are you saying that
NASCAR-FANS are dumb red-necks? while I am not a big fan of NASCAR...
I do think that it is not very intelligant on your part to make them kind of
comments. but for arguements sake.....which group are the intelligent ones?
Jane of Arc
11/22/05, 12:31 pm
I was kidding, but you're right snowdog! I stand corrected! I apologize to Nascar fans. Not all of you are uneducated red-necks!
Due to my gazillion years in college getting degrees ... I can be an elitist snob ... and I apologize.
In AZ. Republic today: "
by Jimmy Breslin, liberal New York City columnist:
"Of the moment: The left turns on Hillary...
ABC news headline: Hillary Clinton defends pro-war vote
Hillary Clinton today holds the new North American record for fakery. She copies. She sneaks and slithers past you with her opinion on a war that kills every day. ... If Hillary Clinton wants this war to go on, then she should send her daughter to fight in Iraq."
Jane of Arc
12/04/05, 10:07 am
Who on the left should be the next president?
Who is outside the Washington bubble and really has a grasp on what the American people want?
Who is an environmentalist?
Who is fiscally responsible?
Who is pro-peace?
Who has the international experience to deal effectively with the root issues of terror?
I think about this a lot ... and the best choice (who already won the presidency) ...
AL GORE
Who on the left should be the next president?
Who is outside the Washington bubble and really has a grasp on what the American people want?
Who is an environmentalist?
Who is fiscally responsible?
Who is pro-peace?
Who has the international experience to deal effectively with the root issues of terror?
I think about this a lot ... and the best choice (who already won the presidency) ...
AL GORE
Well What? Here's the rest of the piece I quoted.......:
"I am not going to make the mistake of supporting a pro-war candidate even if she is a democrat." quote from "Anti-war mom Cindy Sheehan, when asked about Clinton's 2008 White House prospects."
"Hillary Clinton can kiss my butt ... That ridiculous, ridiculous statement she's made on Iraq." Quote from "Tim Robbins, leftist activist and actor"
AND:
"WHO IS THIS HILLARY CLINTON? IT IS TIME FOR ALL THE SPINELESS POLS TO CRAWL INTO A HOLE. I WANT A HELLFIRE POLITICIAN. I WANT AL GORE WITH AN ATTITUDE." quote from "Letter writer to left-wing Web site huffingtonpost.com" This article originated from
Sources: Oneonta (N.Y.) Daily Star; Huffington Post; mSNBC; Newsday
:)
Can a "pro-peace" and therefore "anti-war" candidate win in today's fearful America?
Hillary doesn't think so - so she's making hawk sounds.
John McCain seems rational and "not so partisan" on many issues, but he also seems to love the Iraq war, while positioning himself for a Presidential run.
Warner is Hawkish.
Intelligent, non-violent approaches don't seem to sell well in America after 9/11.
Isn't the American public tired of "cowboy" now that they've seen the results?
I'd like a link for "Warner is Hawkish" if you have one. I had the same initial impression, but been having a hard time making a case for it.
Jane of Arc
12/05/05, 06:21 pm
Can a "pro-peace" and therefore "anti-war" candidate win in today's fearful America?
Hillary doesn't think so - so she's making hawk sounds.
John McCain seems rational and "not so partisan" on many issues, but he also seems to love the Iraq war, while positioning himself for a Presidential run.
Warner is Hawkish.
Intelligent, non-violent approaches don't seem to sell well in America after 9/11.
Isn't the American public tired of "cowboy" now that they've seen the results?
The American people know something's amiss. That's why over 60% say they want out of the war. Could The People be waking up? God, I hope so. Meanwhile Hillary is on a "anti-flag burning" kick! Oh Puh-leeze! She couldn't be more pathetic and obvious as she grovels for right-wing votes.
The American people know something's amiss. That's why over 60% say they want out of the war. Could The People be waking up? God, I hope so. Meanwhile Hillary is on a "anti-flag burning" kick! Oh Puh-leeze! She couldn't be more pathetic and obvious as she grovels for right-wing votes.
I always felt it was O.K. to make a statement for justice..........by burning a beloved flag preferably on the court House steps! I thought WE had that problem solved ALREADY!
OH Hillary, to think once, long ago, I defended you......................
Jane of Arc
12/06/05, 09:59 am
MAGI ... you will appreciate this ... a Progressive Democrat is challenging Hillary in the next election! What kind of message does that send to Democrats all over the country?? STOP BEING REPUBLICANS! AND the contender, Jonathan Tasini, is backed by Cindy Sheehan and Murtha.
Check this out:
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2005/120505A.shtml
http://www.tasinifornewyork.org/
gratelady1
12/06/05, 10:05 am
Please!!!
WE COULD ONLY DREAM OF SUCH AN EVENT!!!!
Wesley Clark wrote a piece on Iraq for the NY Times.
I find it disappointing.
It basically perpetuates the fantasy of American victory and having it our way in the Middle-East and says: Bush is failing, but let's stay in Iraq, do a little more and get even more involved.
Excerpts:
Intro: As you all know, General Clark has never been a supporter of President Bush's decision to go to war in Iraq -- repeatedly calling it a "strategic blunder" -- but now that we're there, he is constantly speaking out on how best we can succeed.
Some key passages from General Clark's op-ed in today's New York Times:
While the Bush administration and its critics escalated the debate last week over how long our troops should stay in Iraq, I was able to see the issue through the eyes of America's friends in the Persian Gulf region. The Arab states agree on one thing: Iran is emerging as the big winner of the American invasion, and both President Bush's new strategy and the Democratic responses to it dangerously miss the point. It's a devastating critique. And, unfortunately, it is correct...
"Staying the course" risks a slow and costly departure of American forces with Iraq increasingly factionalized and aligned with Iran. Yet a more rapid departure of American troops along a timeline, as some Democrats are calling for, simply reduces our ability to affect the outcome and risks broader regional conflict. We need to keep our troops in Iraq, but we need to modify the strategy far more drastically than anything President Bush called for last week...
On the military side, American and Iraqi forces must take greater control of the country's borders, not only on the Syrian side but also in the east, on the Iranian side. The current strategy of clearing areas near Syria of insurgents and then posting Iraqi troops, backed up by mobile American units, has had success. But it needs to be expanded, especially in the heavily Shiite regions in the southeast, where there has been continuing cross-border traffic from Iran and where the loyalties of the Iraqi troops will be especially tested...
As important as these military changes are, they won't matter at all unless our political strategy is rethought. First, the Iraqis must change the Constitution as quickly as possible after next week's parliamentary elections. Most important, oil revenues should be declared the property of the central government, not the provinces. And the federal concept must be modified to preclude the creation of a Shiite autonomous region in the south...
And we must start using America's diplomatic strength with Syria and Iran....
What a disaster it would be if the real winner in Iraq turned out to be Iran, a country that supports terrorism and opposes most of what we stand for. Surely, we can summon the wisdom, resources and bipartisan leadership to change the American course before it is too late
MAGI ... you will appreciate this ... a Progressive Democrat is challenging Hillary in the next election! What kind of message does that send to Democrats all over the country?? STOP BEING REPUBLICANS! AND the contender, Jonathan Tasini, is backed by Cindy Sheehan and Murtha.
Check this out:
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2005/120505A.shtml
http://www.tasinifornewyork.org/
"His campaign seems pretty straightforward - he's going after Clinton on the Iraq War, and advocating for a renegotiation of "free" trade deals and the extension of Medicare to cover all Americans. ...Read Article"
Was out today & just had a chance for a quick read. This copy & paste is from one of your links What? and WOW, I'm impressed!
Hey James, I recently saw Clark on one of the TV shows & he spoke then as is in the Times article. I was turned off with him then as I believe you are.
How could any of those Washington insiders ever believe Iran was not going to have the advantage it now has? I didn't know that Chalabi was kicking around Washington for 15 years......or know what kind of a person he is........but THEY DID. THEY KNEW what Chalabi was all about!
Bushco's plan was to get Chalabi into power and HE would then give them access to OIL production.............. as long as he got HIS enrichment in the process. (MAYBE ?) :rolleyes:
Neither could trust either......and Clark is surprized? Anyone who has been in Washington is?
I hope to Goodness the 3 Iraqi factions recognise this and say "We MUST work together for the good of Iraq" & "to HELL with Iran and the U.S., not to mention Syria,Turkey, Saudi Arabia & ???"
Oh, if only the Iraqis' will do IT!
It seems that Clark & most other political contenders are concerned with being labeled "cut & run" (new Republican "catch-phrase" appealing to feeble-minded, overweight American males living out their "tough-guy" fantasies thru movies, video games & "shock & awe" bombing campaigns).
As such, they all want to have a "plan for victory" in Iraq.
The "plan" involves spending more money we don't have and more proletariat lives in Iraq, while waiting for the American people to overwhelming support withdrawal. And, as always, the rich further enrich themselves in the process.
I'd like to think the Iraqis can come together ultimately, but it is more likely that the "tribal divisions" in their culture run deep and that they are much more likely to further divide.
Only a simpleton from Texas with a "God complex" could possibly fantasize about transforming such a culture...
or maybe a group of elite capitalists looking for a cover to steal resources.
littlebigman
12/14/05, 01:01 am
I always felt it was O.K. to make a statement for justice..........by burning a beloved flag preferably on the court House steps! I thought WE had that problem solved ALREADY!
OH Hillary, to think once, long ago, I defended you......................
6 or so months bak i made a post at a site that said sumtn like...
if any1 votes 4 hillary n the cum'n pres elaction i will cum 2 ur house and sit on ur porch 4ever...like a big pile of trash...just 2 remind u 4ever what a tragic diservice u did 2 us all...
i was quikly banned...
hillary suks...eh...er...well i guess not cuz if she did bill would b stay'n home more proly...
:eek:
Jane of Arc
12/29/05, 08:52 am
LBM ~ What site would ban you for making an anti-Hillary statement? Ever since her pro-war stance, silly pro-flag legislation many, many progressives are avoiding her like the plague. Can you name them? I'd be curious.
Thanks :)
MyDD.com (http://myDD.com) just started their Janurary '08 Straw Poll. The results are kind of interesting. Feingold jumped from #2 to #1 in December (all last year, Clark won big), and this month he wins in the final runoff round with over 60% of the vote.
The story is here: http://www.mydd.com/story/2006/1/3/13324/31222 and the poll is here:http://www.demochoice.org/dcballot.php?poll=MyDD0106
Jane of Arc
01/04/06, 07:29 pm
Thank you haus!!! That is actually the best news I've had in a while. A man fighting to end the corrupt US elections is in the number one spot. I have a smile on my face!
I'm kicking around the idea of re-starting this poll, and welcome input on who'd you like to see on it. For my $0.02, I'd definitely have Feingold, Edwards, Clark and Warner. Probably HRC because she's the current frontrunner. Maybe Kerry.
Gore keeps saying he's not going to run, but What? will probably talk me into including him :)
One should always be cautious about simple models of complicated subjects, but here's a graph showing the potential candidates on social and economic issues derived from data from ontheissues.org:
http://headstrong-america.org/liberal-meter.jpg
Further explanation and links to the potential candidates pages at ontheissues.org is available here (http://headstrong-america.blogspot.com/2005/12/graph-rates-2008-hopefuls-on-issues.html). ProgressivePunch (progressivepunch.com) also has very good analysis on the potentials who are currently in the US Senate.
I sincerely believe Barach Obama should be on the list! Of ALL mentioned and listening to them......Obama would be MY choice........but would he win? So Edwards/Obama ............best in my eyes if the vote was tomorrow.
Obama has had a buzz going for him since the last election.
Haus, indeed you should open a new poll about every 4 months. New candidates will emerge and people will change their minds.
You might want to call it
2008 Candidates: Who's your choice? (01/06 snapshot)
It would probably be best to merge the posts into the new thread. Let me know if you need help.
Jane of Arc
01/14/06, 04:25 pm
Yes Haus ~ Gore has to be included in the poll ... or ... or ... I'll spit ... or ... or set my hair on fire ... or ... or ... flush my hamster down the toilet! Oh wait ... I don't have a hamster. Plus, I'm a member of PETA . But, I'll do something drastic, if you don't include Gore.
Plus ... he might run. There's a big Draft Gore campaign underway. He's a political animal AND he's giving a BIG anti-Bush speech. Check this out from The Nation. Here's an excerpt:
http://www.thenation.com/blogs/thebeat?pid=49140
Gore to Address "Constitutional Crisis"
It sounds as if Al Gore is about to deliver what could be not just one of the more significant speeches of his political career but an essential challenge to the embattled presidency of George W. Bush.
In a major address slated for delivery Monday in Washington, the former Vice President is expected to argue that the Bush administration has created a "Constitutional crisis" by acting without the authorization of the Congress and the courts to spy on Americans and otherwise abuse basic liberties.
Aides who are familiar with the preparations for the address say that Gore will frame his remarks in Constitutional language. The Democrat who beat Bush by more than 500,000 votes in the 2000 presidential election has agreed to deliver his remarks in a symbolically powerful location: the historic Constitution Hall of the Daughters of the American Revolution. But this will not be the sort of cautious, bureacratic speech for which Gore was frequently criticized during his years in the Senate and the White House.
OK -- I'll put the new poll up on Sunday afternoon and add Obama and Gore. Any other requests?
Let's get ready to rumble! Here's the new 2008 Candidates Poll. Take a minute to vote and feel free to explain here why your candidate is the coolest.
I WANT ALL my countrymen to hear Obama and contemplate his views............ Intelligent, kind and VERY diplomatic!
John Edwards is a brilliant sensitive charismatic SOUTHERN man with excellent democratic values...............
I have NOTHING against Gore.......and very much reflect his ideals.
I very much stood with Feingold against the IRAQ INVASION as he did BEFORE the invasion as NOW, but there were a few things about him that bothered me.......... will give it another look, as always.......................
I just FEEL at this point Edwards/Obama are the most likely to WIN and both have qualities I stand solidly FOR.
O.K., Popular president elect winner of 2000, .............
I change my mind, GORE/OBAMA
GREAT SPEECH
Jane of Arc
01/16/06, 11:45 am
O.K., Popular president elect winner of 2000, .............
I change my mind, GORE/OBAMA
GREAT SPEECH
Damn! I missed it!!!!! :mad: MAGI~ it was on C-SPAN, right? Will it be on later? :confused:
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